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Thread: With EXTREME REGRET I post this warning.......

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2003
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    Wakeman, Ohio
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    5,443

    Default With EXTREME REGRET I post this warning.......

    I HATE making this post.

    As some of you have been following I built a new stroker for the Bad Bish. It was the best engine I have ever had in the car. I couldn't have been happier with it. As you can tell I am speaking in past tense........

    I loaded the car on the dyno after parking it from it's 725 whp pull at only 31 psi. I wanted to finish up the tune and then test the new header I built.

    The first pull I attempted in 3rd gear, blew the tires off. Second pull I tried in 4th and the car ran like crap, very odd I thought. I had just switched the Haltech from V1.06 to V1.08 and built a completely new map for the car but was sure it was right. I checked my work and then noticed the idle was at about 2200 rpm. Very-very odd. I tried another map, idle stayed high. Not happy. I tried a few more pulls, the car just kept getting worse. I shut it off to put in a fresh set of plugs, the plugs I took out looked, literally, like new. Not even carbon on them yet. Odd. When I got back in and cranked the engine over I could hear there was a serious problem, I could hear it was hurt and down at least one cylinder while cranking it over........WTF?!! I figured the hell with it and attempted another pull, wouldn't even make it past 5,000 rpm it was running so bad.

    I took the car off the dyno and parked it in it's normal spot. I felt the runners of the headers and could tell #1 was the cylinder without compression. The next day I went in and pulled the plugs, #1 was fine, #2 was smashed all to hell, 3 and 4 were fine. This made no sense. I pulled the head off and found complete destruction...........sick to my stomach and pissed off now. I assumed maybe a part failed, like a valve broke off or the piston broke. Nope, valves all look correct, pistons too. It's so clean inside it's hard to tell it's been run. #1 and #2 cylinders are literally beat to hell and back. SOMETHING got in the engine and apparently went into #1 first, bounced around and was pounded and then made it into #2 and did the same thing. A check of the turbo revealed the turbine wheel was completely trashed..........

    Yesterday I decided to take a closer look to figure out what could have possibly just destroyed the best engine I've ever had. I noticed that I could see thread marks embedded in the combustion chamber of the head. Small threads, WTF could that have come from? I then remembered the idle going high and flipped the head on it's end to look in the throttle body...........yep that's it. A .15 cent screw just took out $6,000+ in parts. The screw that holds the throttle plate in somehow worked out and went through the engine. You gotta be fucking kidding me.

    Now, this throttle body was the first we ever built. We Loctite every single screw in the throttle body when we build them. Why it happened, I don't know.

    The warning is. Take 5 minutes to take your I/C pipes loose from the throttle body if you have an aftermarket throttle body on your car and just check those screws quickly. This is the first I've ever seen this happen in 22+ years of doing this but because it did, take 5 minutes to check yours.

    The damage to the block is horrible, it looks like part of the screw, after being broken and smashed, got stuck between the piston and cylinder wall leaving a DEEP set of scratches. Cylinder head is beat to hell in the combustion chambers and the turbo is junk. This is a good $6,000+ repair by the time it's done.

    I guess it's part of the game.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    usa
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    78

    Default

    dam this blows, i was looking forward to seeing another dyno pull from this 2.3.

    what are your rebuild plans? puttting another 2.3 in it?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
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    LaGrange, ohio
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    Default

    Dam dave... Makes me wanna throw up....... Any chance you're switching back to the ported stocker?

    So What you're saying is that screw fucked up cylinder 1, went threw the turbo, trashed that, then made its way threw the i/c and back into cylinder 2.... god dam...

    I always assumed if something made it into the i/c it would bet trapped somehow...

    Put a tack-weld on that screw?
    95 AWD-auto
    EVO3 / 450cc / 255pump / Hard pipes / MLS-ARPs / 3" c-b .

    Precision Billet Converter 3500 stall/ IPT end clutch kit/ IPT valve body.....All on the way....

    DSM LINK is next..

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
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    Cincinnati, OH
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lonnie gandee View Post
    Dam dave... Makes me wanna throw up....... Any chance you're switching back to the ported stocker?

    So What you're saying is that screw fucked up cylinder 1, went threw the turbo, trashed that, then made its way threw the i/c and back into cylinder 2.... god dam...

    I always assumed if something made it into the i/c it would bet trapped somehow...

    Put a tack-weld on that screw?
    pieces/parts don't magically go from the hot side to the cold side. lol

    Sounds like the screw broke into 2 pieces and one went into each cylinder. Sorry to hear David.
    Checkbook Racer.
    10.4@135 - 93 octane
    9.9@146 - Q16

  5. #5
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    May 2003
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    Absolutely, no doubt about it will duplicate this engine and put it right back in, it was simply bad ass. I can't imagine running anything else after the short time I had running this.

    The screw came loose, went into cylinder #1 and then was kicked out and ran into cylinder #2. We see this type of thing happen a lot when something gets in an engine or when one cylinder is damaged, it can travel out of the intake port, back into the intake and then into another cylinder.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    San Antonio, Texas
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    I had this EXACT same thing happen to me. My BBK 75mm throttle body came apart on the dyno. One of the little screws in the throttle plate came apart and tore up #1 combustion chamber and beat #1 piston all to hell. I was pissed it tore my brand new BR stage 3 head all up!! I had to replaced the piston and had the head fixed. Luckily the scew didnt get down past the piston...

    I ended up having a billet plate built for the throttle body with a better shaft and larger screws. Havent had any issues with it since. But I do take off the upper i/c pipe from time to time now and check it out.
    Chris
    90 GSX
    BR stage 3 2.0L, AEM EMS, FP3052

  7. #7
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    Jan 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by SloRice View Post
    pieces/parts don't magically go from the hot side to the cold side. lol

    .
    I posted without my head on... Duh, that makes sense....
    95 AWD-auto
    EVO3 / 450cc / 255pump / Hard pipes / MLS-ARPs / 3" c-b .

    Precision Billet Converter 3500 stall/ IPT end clutch kit/ IPT valve body.....All on the way....

    DSM LINK is next..

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    usa
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    Default

    awesome glad to hear it, if anything was to happen to my engine that bad boy woould be going into my car.

    Quote Originally Posted by David Buschur View Post
    Absolutely, no doubt about it will duplicate this engine and put it right back in, it was simply bad ass. I can't imagine running anything else after the short time I had running this.

    The screw came loose, went into cylinder #1 and then was kicked out and ran into cylinder #2. We see this type of thing happen a lot when something gets in an engine or when one cylinder is damaged, it can travel out of the intake port, back into the intake and then into another cylinder.

  9. #9
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    May 2003
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    I just took the head/intake etc. apart so we can start new stuff. I think the head is actually salvageable. We are going to get the valves out of it and do a little welding on it and then port the combustion chambers a bit, I think we can save it. The block, which is what I'd have preferred to have been good, is junk.

    It's incredible to me how many guys have said they either had this happen to them personally or to a friend.......

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Dublin, Ohio
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    115

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    Yep Dave, hate to say it, I seen the same thing at Bonneville on a 4G63. Now they mushroom the bottom of the Screw with a punch.
    Mike Meierle
    #847 F/BMMP
    BNI/ECTA
    ECTA Record Holder/Bonneville Record Holder

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
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    Ellwood city, PA
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    Default

    Wow Dave sorry to hear this! I have also heard of this happening a bunch of times over the years on different forums also.
    Do you own a EVO? No I do not. Then what the hell are you doing here!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Oswego, IL
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    14

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    Jesus...very sorry to hear this, Dave. Having a nice fresh engine destroyed, especially one that was running so well, must be a real kick in the balls. At least you're keeping a positive attitude about it. Rebuild it and get it back on the road! Good luck with the rebuild.
    BR 2.3 Stroker
    BR Forward Facing HTA86
    605whp & 513wtq @ 32 psi on E85 (BR Mustang Dyno)
    Tuned By David Buschur

  13. #13
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    wow sorry bro
    I USE AND ONLY SUPPORT THE BEST. IF BUSCHUR MAKES IT, I HAVE IT
    Buschur Built and Tuned... 9sec full weight street car.
    10.35 at 144.97 on only 32psi and ban from LVMS no highboost pass for me EVER
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  14. #14
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    The idea of that makes me sick to my stomach. I'm sorry for the bad luck. Goodluck getting it back together, and I'm glad atleast the head is salvageable (it could be a total loss). It will all be worth it when your running 8's this year!

  15. #15
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    That sucks to hear Dave.
    Squarepants Racing
    Buschur Racing
    '03 lightening yellow evo
    348 whp and 305 trq on BR dyno 12.5@110 mph
    '03 Tarmac Black evo8 (sold) : (
    1.7 60ft 10.86@133 mph on pump/meth
    Buschur ReTuned built 2.3, 40R 571 awhp, 444 awtrq pump/meth. 617 whp, 486 trq C16 map

    '91 red 1G Talon on the way!

  16. #16
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    That really sucks... sorry to hear about that David.

    My friend once bought a pristine white 98 gsx shell, and a certified complete used engine to put in it. A few mintutes after start-up it start making a loud knocking noise from the cylinder head. He pulled the head off and found the bottom of the head all beat up and some valves damaged. There was no evidence of what caused it. Asuming it was pre-existing damage he called the company he got the engine from and rose hell with them. I don't know if they did anything for him, but he had a spare head that he put on. Same thing happened only worse. Head came back off and there was a drill bit stuck in one of the pistons - WTF. He ended up finding a couple handfuls of broken drill bits in the intercooler endtank. Why there would ever be a bunch of drill bits in there I have no idea. My friend was livid pissed. The intercooler and piping was in place when we brought the car home, and it was in such great shape I guess he didn't think to go through it.

  17. #17
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    Damn that's sickening! Sorry to hear but im sure you'll have her up and running in no time
    DB quote "....this isn't some chinese piece of shit...."

  18. #18
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    Little Iphone video I did the pull before things went to crap.

    This was just of how good the car idles, drives and the crazy ass tire spin in 3rd gear. Remember the car is on RE01's, 245-45-17's and strapped down tight!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4C2VYvAIzD4

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Buschur View Post
    It's incredible to me how many guys have said they either had this happen to them personally or to a friend.......
    I was at a dyno tuning session and the exact same symptoms you stated starting happening to the car. Poor idle, breaking up, etc. Luckily, someone there watching had the same thing happen to them and started screaming to shut it down. Sure enough - plate was flopping around and the screws were almost all the way out. Another pull or even a few more seconds of vibration and that kid could have left with a paper weight and not a tuned car.
    05' Evo 8 SSL
    : : Serenity : :
    Buschur Powered


    BR 2.4 - #001
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  20. #20
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    looks like I need to redue my build... fuck dude! BHAHAHA
    I USE AND ONLY SUPPORT THE BEST. IF BUSCHUR MAKES IT, I HAVE IT
    Buschur Built and Tuned... 9sec full weight street car.
    10.35 at 144.97 on only 32psi and ban from LVMS no highboost pass for me EVER
    http://www.buschurracing.com/
    http://www.awdmotorsports.com/
    http://www.shearerfabrications.com
    http://www.cbrdspeedfactory.com/
    www.myspace.com/vwjeff

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